Ingredient Order off for Whirlpool Hops

I entered in the Northern Brewer Off the Topper kit into BeerSmith. It Has a two step whirlpool addition, first right at flame out with a 15 minute steep. Then cool to 180 degrees and add a second batch and steep for an additional 15 minutes. I entered the first addition with a 15 minute whirlpool to calculate some IBU to the recipe, and the second addition as a zero minute whirlpool since it would be at lower temps and therefor less or no IBU addition. The order of the whirlpool hops does not sort correctly. The following shows how the hops are displayed and printed.

2.00 oz Simply Select Hop Blend [6.60 %] - Steep/Whirlpool 15.0 min Hop 8 9.0 IBUs
1.00 oz Amarillo [8.40 %] - Steep/Whirlpool 0.0 min Hop 9 0.0 IBUs
1.00 oz Columbus (Tomahawk) [15.60 %] - Steep/Whirlpool 0.0 min Hop 10 0.0 IBUs
1.00 oz Columbus (Tomahawk) [15.60 %] - Steep/Whirlpool 15.0 min Hop 11 10.7 IBUs
1.00 oz Simply Select Hop Blend [6.60 %] - Steep/Whirlpool 0.0 min Hop 12 0.0 IBUs
0.50 oz Apollo [17.70 %] - Steep/Whirlpool 0.0 min Hop 13 0.0 IBUs
0.50 oz Apollo [17.70 %] - Steep/Whirlpool 15.0 min Hop 14 6.0 IBUs
0.50 oz Centennial [8.40 %] - Steep/Whirlpool 0.0 min Hop 15 0.0 IBUs

First, your whirlpool times should be entered as time steeping, not the time added.  Your 0 minute adds would be steeped for 30 minutes, if I am reading your description correctly. 

Next, BeerSmith does not seem to be recognizing the whirlpool times as a method of sorting.  I played around with your recipe after resetting the steeping times and still have the same issue that you encountered.  This will hopefully be addressed with the next update (?).

Oginme said:

First, your whirlpool times should be entered as time steeping, not the time added.  Your 0 minute adds would be steeped for 30 minutes, if I am reading your description correctly. 

Next, BeerSmith does not seem to be recognizing the whirlpool times as a method of sorting.  I played around with your recipe after resetting the steeping times and still have the same issue that you encountered.  This will hopefully be addressed with the next update (?).

Click to expand...

Thanks for your response and input.
The hops are being entered as "Steeping Hops", and the times I entered are for steeping time. I fudge the order/length a bit in order to get the IBU calculations. My 15 minute additions are actually done at flame out, and total steep would be 30 minutes, 15 while hot and 15 at 180 or less. Mainly I'm looking to have BeerSmith at least group steeping hops together based on their steeping times. Right now I'm not sure what order it puts them in and I do not believe BeerSmith is sorting within "Whirlpool" additions based on time of steep.
Cheers

metron-brewer said:

Mainly I'm looking to have BeerSmith at least group steeping hops together based on their steeping times. Right now I'm not sure what order it puts them in and I do not believe BeerSmith is sorting within "Whirlpool" additions based on time of steep.

Click to expand...

Dynamic whirlpool times may get addressed in a future update. The sort order is weight first, then description. Times are embedded in the description, but not sorted that way. I agree that it should be sorting by time, just the same as the boil.

Dynamic whirlpool timing is a technique developed after the release of the hops book. It isn't supported by much more than observations. The main thing is that once you've reached 100 IBUs with the Hop Shot, the rest of the isomers break as fast as they're made, but flavonoids are created that bloom during fermentation. That's the magic of IIPA.

The upper end of taste threshold is 50-60 IBUs, according to recent industry articles. So, any number above 100 is meaningless in both measurement and taste. Bitterness texture has more relevance to perception than actual IBUs.

brewfun said:

metron-brewer said:

Mainly I'm looking to have BeerSmith at least group steeping hops together based on their steeping times. Right now I'm not sure what order it puts them in and I do not believe BeerSmith is sorting within "Whirlpool" additions based on time of steep.

Click to expand...

Dynamic whirlpool times may get addressed in a future update. The sort order is weight first, then description. Times are embedded in the description, but not sorted that way. I agree that it should be sorting by time, just the same as the boil.

Dynamic whirlpool timing is a technique developed after the release of the hops book. It isn't supported by much more than observations. The main thing is that once you've reached 100 IBUs with the Hop Shot, the rest of the isomers break as fast as they're made, but flavonoids are created that bloom during fermentation. That's the magic of IIPA.

The upper end of taste threshold is 50-60 IBUs, according to recent industry articles. So, any number above 100 is meaningless in both measurement and taste. Bitterness texture has more relevance to perception than actual IBUs.

Click to expand...

Thanks for the clarification as well as the info on the sort order. I'm definitely looking forward to "magical flavonoids"
Cheers,
Ron