grain to add more colour in IPA

[arctic78]

I am putting together an IPA recipe and need some more colour. my base malt is marris otter @5kg I was wanting to use this alone but going of the BS EBC colour for the style it is to light with this grain alone. I was playing around and added some munich malt @ .6kg and (17ebc) and also some vienna  malt @.3 and (6.9ebc) This brings the predicted colour in at 12ebc and the minimum for the style says 11.8ebc.
So I guess I am asking do I need to add these or should I add something else or is it really that important to get the colour up and just stick with the marris otter alone ?
Some advise or comments on what you my do in your brews would be appreciated.

Also I am looking at using warrior as my bittering hop then simcoe and mosaic for flavour/Aroma I am using 25 grams simcoe and 20 grams mosaic this gives me 59.9IBU's not sure if this pairing works or I should go for something else .

Thanks. 

[Oginme]

You should be fine with the color.  Unless you are specifically brewing to enter a competition, it really will not make much of a difference.  I will sometimes slip a little Carafa special I (like 10 or 20 grams) just to tweak the color up a bit without much impact on flavor.  I do like your choice of Munich and Vienna to add a little more complexity to the malty flavors.

On the hops, Warrior is a pretty neutral bittering hop and works fine with a wide variety of flavor/aroma hops.  Mosaic is a daughter of Simcoe, so they will play nicely together.  In my experience, Mosaic will add a bit more tropical fruitiness that the Simcoe lacks.

[arctic78]

Thanks for your advise .
                                    I was not that sure how to get a bit more colour or if it really was that necessary, and it turns out it is not. It is good to know that by adding very small amount of dark grain that I can adjust the colour if needed.
As for the munich and vienna I thought they may help since I am mashing at 64c . but the amounts I chose to use are a bit of a stab in the dark.

The hops is nice to know also that they should work together ok . I guess I just have to work on the amounts of each and their addition times  and see what I like. I think the pairing or combinations of hops is a difficult thing. I know it is up to individuals taste but I think also in my last couple of beers I overdone the tropical fruit thing and they needed to have something to even them out a bit . 

[Maine Homebrewer]

A few ounces of dark crystal malt will add color and body.

[arctic78]

I was trying not to add crystal just because of what I had read about not using it in IPA's .  but I really have no real reason or any experience to go on just what the style states and what I have come across on line. What sort of % of it would you use in your grain bill??
 

[Maine Homebrewer]

I don't know about percentages, but I usually add a half pound or so of crystal to my IPAs. They come out dandy.

[Oginme]

I was trying not to add crystal just because of what I had read about not using it in IPA's .  but I really have no real reason or any experience to go on just what the style states and what I have come across on line. What sort of % of it would you use in your grain bill??

In the end it comes down to personal taste.  I have some IPA recipes (I design my own) which have a fair amount of crystal in them and others that rely more on either Vienna or Munich malts to help provide a malt balance to the high hop flavors and bitterness.  Almost all of my initial recipes I had designed to match BJCP style guidelines.  It gave me a target which was well known and through those initial recipes I developed an appreciation for balance, different malt flavors and various hop profiles. 

Now I find that about 50% of what I brew are 'tweeners' or something between a couple of well known styles.  The rest are more catching up on designing recipes to match some of the newer styles which have recently been published.

[arctic78]

 Thanks for the info about what you do for your own beers, It all helps to understand what can be used in a recipe to add some balance. I did think that you could use what ever you wanted but i am trying to just get a good understanding for my first few all grain brew's about what works . Then i can play round and fine tune things to my taste as i get a better understanding.
Would like to know why they say IPA should not use crystal as i have found quite a few recipes now that use it.

Again thanks for your help.

[Maine Homebrewer]

Personally I like to add some crystal to my IPAs because the added body balances out the bitterness. You can get the same effect with a higher mash temperature, and I suppose that's what the purists are saying you should do. I prefer to use crystal for the body, and then mash at a lower temperature because that's what I'm used to. Unless you're taking the stuff to a contest so a bunch of snobs can criticize it, just do what tasted good to you.

[arctic78]

LOL    I got to say that sounds good to me . I am doing it for myself and no one else so what I like is what I should do.

[joejarboe]

I would not be afraid to add some Caramel/Crystal into your IPA.  Depending on what you are trying to get in flavor I think you will find anything in the less than 40L range will be more of an assist to the beer than a detriment.  Even most Blondes will even have some 10 or 15 in them ---  For your IPA the bigger factor will be the use of Hops.  I'd recommend at least 3 oz in the boil - 1 oz at 60 minutes - 1 oz at 10 or 15 min and another 1oz at 5 min ...   Then I'd say dry hop with about 3 oz for a full week after primary...  If you are going bigger than this all the better... I was a little "shy" on using a lot of hops in my first beer - and have since learned that lesson!    Good luck and happy brewing!!!