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Is It Stuck or Slow

Sremed60

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This is a first for me. I brewed a Belgian Strong Dark last week, (7 days ago to be exact). I used Wyeast #3787 Trappist High Gravity yeast. I oxygenated and pitched roughly 400-430 billion cells. I was using a plastic fermentation bucket (which I always use for primary) so I just stuck a 3 piece airlock in it, (like I always do). I set the ferment temp to 68. The next day I had happy yeast bubbling all over, up through the airlock, all over the lid, down into the temp probe tube, and all over the inside of my fermentation chamber. The lid on the plastic bucket was bulging and straining, but hadn't blown off. I wiped it down real good and sanitized the lid then pulled the airlock out and replaced it with a makeshift blow off tube, (the bottom piece of another airlock with 1/2" hose into a 1 qt bottle 1/3rd full of sanitizer). The next day the blow-off bottle was also full of yeast and some had leaked into the chamber, but not as bad as the first bubble over. By the 3rd day it had slowed down considerably so I let it go. I bumped the temp up from 68F degrees to 70F degrees. I've checked every day and it's still bubbling, but very slow. 1 bubble every 2 or 3  seconds or so.

Today it's been 7 days and it's still slowly bubbling, but I figured that after 7 days certainly it had finished fermenting and the bubbles I was seeing were just escaping CO2. So I popped it open to take a test sample. There is still an extremely thick mass of foam on top.

The OG was 1.073, which was a little low but I didn't get the amount of boil off I usually do so my volume was more than calculated. The FG is calculated to be 1.015 for an abv of about 9.8%. This yeast is supposed to tolerate 11%-12% in a temp range of 68F-78F, so I'm well within those boundaries. Last night I bumped the temp in the chamber up from 70F to 72F to finish.

The gravity reading this morning was 1.028 - only about half way there. Is this stuck or just slow. I wasn't planning to use a secondary on this. My plan was to give it 10-12 days in primary and bottle condition until December for Christmas gifts. I assumed it would be done fermenting after at most 5 or 6 days.

So I stuck the lid back on and let it go. Wondering if I should stir it up? I don't want to use a secondary if I can help it. I want this beer to age well so I'm taking precautions to limit as much oxygen as possible. It's going to bottle condition for two and a half months at room temp, 78F-80F.

Any suggestions are appreciated.

I used two packages of Wyeast to make two 2L starters because I didn't have a way to make one big starter. One starter was on the stir plate for 2 days, the other I just used the shake it every time you walk by method. I put them in the fridge 2 nights before I brewed to settle. I decanted one starter and poured the slurry into the other starter, then just pitched that whole thing.

The yeast was obviously very happy in the beginning - just wondering why it slowed down all of a sudden and what I should do to kick start it. At $8 a package I seriously don't want to add more yeast if I can help it. This beer has already cost me almost $90 for a 5.5 gallon (turned out to be 6 gallon) batch
 
My initial thought was to use my Mr. Malty app to calculate your actual yeast needs (as 400-430b seems quite high) and I came up with only 301b cells were needed with a viability date of early September, 2016. So I then used three different on-line calculators and all of them said the same that for a SG of 1.073. 300b cells are all that's required. However, I believe the calculations in BS are slightly higher but not nearly 30% higher.

So, my quess is much of the good viable yeast got jettisoned from the fermenter with the blow out and then with the blow-through. So, what to do...  I would wait it out and check my fermentation every couple days to see how it's progressing and if it's not progressing fast enough, I would pitch additional yeast based on the SG you measured at the time you go to pitch the additional yeast.
 
So I then used three different on-line calculators and all of them said the same that for a SG of 1.073. 300b cells are all that's required. However, I believe the calculations in BS are slightly higher but not nearly 30% higher.
The OG was supposed to be 1.089 and if I remember correctly it calculated out to 444 billion cells for a high gravity beer. I only have a 2000ml erlenmeyer flask and the last time I did a 2L starter (different yeast) it ended up foaming all over the counter. One starter with one package of yeast didn't seem to be quite enough, 2 was probably extreme over kill. Admittedly, I didn't focus on the yeast or starter aspect as much as I probably should have this time. My thinking was that it's a big beer so over pitching a bit was better than under pitching - and after my original calculations (weeks ago when I was designing), I just had it in my head to use 2 packages and make two starters.

Would it help to stir up the trub at this point?

I don't brew during the summer. Here in Phoenix it's not worth the hassle the time and the expense (for me) of trying to maintain fermentation temps for several weeks or months when the ambient temp outside is the same as the surface of the sun. So this was my first brew in 4 or 5 months and I was a bit rusty. I designed the recipe last Spring with the intention that the first beer I would brew, either at the end of Sept or the beginning of Oct, was going to be a Belgian Quad. Then I got the idea that it would make good Christmas gifts, so I decided to brew it a few weeks ahead of schedule, (kind of a last minute decision), just to get an extra couple of weeks aging. It ended up being a kind of haphazard effort. Too many other things going on and I didn't focus as much attention on this as I should have. I figured ingredients at around $50, but by the time I added on all the other stuff I was out of, and corks and cages, plus price increases at the LHBS I wasn't aware of, it came to $87 to get going. Then I had issues with the mash that I haven't had before. I used a 15.5 gallon keggle I bought (for the first time) instead of the 10 gallon kettle I have been using. It took quite a while of messing with my propane burner to get it to blow hot enough to get a rolling boil going. I couldn't figure out if the regulator was screwing up, if the flame air mixture was off, or if it was just because of the different shape of the bottom of the keggle vs the flat bottom of the old kettle. By the time I got it worked out and got enough heat to get a rolling boil going it had been slowly simmering for over 30 minutes, acting like it was (just about) to start boiling, but never quite getting there. I had it figured for a 90 minute boil but decided with almost 45 minutes of (almost) boiling it wouldn't hurt to cut it back to a 75 minute boil. I did an iodine test and had full conversion. My recipe called for 8.6 gallons preboil for 5.5 gallons in the fermenter, (using my old equipment profile). I hit 8.6 dead on, but at the end of the boil I had about 6.5 gallons to put in a 6.5 gallon bucket. I put 6 in and poured the 1/2 gallon out in the grass. I assumed the small amount of head space probably accounted for a lot of the bubble over from the yeast.

To make a long story short - this beer has been a complete pain in my a$$ since the get-go and I'm not spending another dime on it. I'm hoping I can get the yeast to wake up and finish the beer, even if it takes a few weeks. If not, it will be a $90 drain pour. It has not been a "fun" brew experience so far.
 
I fully understand your plight.  I still believe you over pitched your yeast. My calculations are around 362b cells needed. So I still believe much of your yeast got dumped. So, I recommend continuing as you are, check the gravity every few days and see how it goes. I'm not sure I would stir up the yeast cake after 7 days of fermentation for fear It would generate some off flavors. However, othernbrewers may feel differently.

Good luck and let us know how it turns out!
 
I still believe you over pitched your yeast. My calculations are around 362b cells needed. So I still believe much of your yeast got dumped.
You're probably right. I used the www.brewersfriend.com yeast pitch rate starter calculator for 1.089 OG, (which this was supposed to be), 5.5 gallons set on Pro Brewer 1.0 (Ale, or High Gravity Ale). That's where I got 444b. The starter I made was probably quite a bit more than that even, but I figured I went over on my volume so. By the time I pitched yeast it was the end of a very long, very hard, very aggravating brew day so at that point I was just going through the motions to get it sealed up and in the fermenter. I didn't stop to re-calculate, so I probably did pitch WAY too much and with the decreased head space and no blow-off tube, that's probably exactly what put me where I am now.

Live and learn

I'm going to keep it at 72F for a few more days then maybe ramp it up to 74F. If it's still sluggish but working by next weekend maybe I'll rack it to secondary and add more yeast. I didn't plan on doing a secondary but I don't want to leave it on this yeast cake much past 14 days either, especially if the yeast is stressed.
 
WY 3787 is a top cropping yeast.  One of the reasons for the blow off besides not having enough head space in your fermentor for this yeast.  This yeast will start fast and slow down.  Plan to leave it in the primary for at least another three weeks.  Check the SG in another week.  Warming the beer to 72°F is appropriate.

The heavy krausen that you see is the best indicator of a fermentation that is continuing.  Don't worry about leaving it on the yeast cake. 
 
It seemed like it was almost at a dead stop. After I tested it I gave the bucket a swirl and put it back in the fermentation chamber. The next morning it was bubbling away again pretty good. Not blowing yeast all over the property - but bubbling nicely, so I was relieved. Time will tell if swirling the yeast cake back up was a good idea or not. I bumped it up to 74F and I'll let it finish out at that, (68F for 3 days, 70F for 3 days, 72F for 3 days, and now 74F til I bottle). After it's bottled I'll store it in the pantry (78F) until December. Then I'll pop the cork on one to see if it's going to be Christmas gifts or lawn fertilizer.

Most of the people I know use Bud Light as their standard by which all beer is measured, so no matter what I'll probably send it out as Christmas gifts. It's the thought that counts. If it's rank with off flavors and they complain I'll just tell them they don't appreciate real beer. 
 
Update:
I bottled this on October 2, 2016, 14 days after brewing. Fermentation stopped and FG was 1.011. I ended up with 26, 750ml Belgian bottles, corked and caged. Packed in 12 bottle boxes and shoved back in a corner on the floor of the pantry, (78 degrees).

I'll try to remember to post another update in December when I pop the cork on one.
 
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