Author Topic: Style question  (Read 5250 times)

Offline brewn

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Style question
« on: November 23, 2017, 08:38:13 AM »
I had some leftover Goldings so I decided to try a S.M.A.S.H.:
5 gal batch
11 lbs Skagit Copeland Pale malt
2 oz Goldings (60 min)
Wyeast 1056

I just shifted to secondary this morning and my readings look good. Actually expected FG is 1.015, I'm already at 1.014. (from 1.054) after 4 days. I taste it and tooting my own horn here, I think this is going to be a really good brew.

But the actual question I have is, what style do you think this would fall under in BS? I currently have American Pale Ale, but I don't think that's what it really is. The hoppiness, isn't there.

Thanks,
Tony
« Last Edit: November 23, 2017, 09:04:08 PM by brewn »

Online Oginme

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Re: Style question
« Reply #1 on: November 23, 2017, 09:08:48 AM »
Kind of hard to tell with not knowing the color, bitterness, and malty flavors you are tasting.  My recommendation is to print out the BJCP guidelines and go through them eliminating any that don't represent what you have brewed.  Obviously dark ales and lagers are out.  Now with the ones that remain, pour yourself a tasting glass, read the descriptions one-by-one and as you smell, taste and evaluate your beer see how well it matches any of the descriptions.

Realize, that not everything will fit neatly into a category and that when you enter a beer into competition, that is how it will be judged.  If it does not quite match any category, I would recommend not bothering with entering a competition, but finding a local club or BJCP judge in your area and asking them to do an evaluation for you.  Most of them are usually happy to comply.

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Offline Kevin58

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Re: Style question
« Reply #2 on: November 23, 2017, 11:46:09 AM »
Sounds like an 1800's Mild or Pale/Bitter. Those early beers often used just pale malt and one hop... more times than not Kent Golding.

I just transcribed a recipe, courtesy Ron Pattinson, from his brew logs that was 100% UK pale malt and 100% Golding hops. It was a Barclay Perkins 1837 XX Ale. That sounds pretty much what you just made.

You won't find any modern beer style guidelines that recognize a pale, hoppy, strong ABV mild but that's what they used to be. I studied Ron's blog and his books and crafted my own style guidelines to match the beers brewed between 1830 and 1900 and added them to my Beersmith software. I currently only have them for milds but I just began working on a Porter/Stout style guide last night.
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Offline Baron Von MunchKrausen

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Re: Style question
« Reply #3 on: November 23, 2017, 12:19:30 PM »
Agreed Kevin.
Sounds like we've been doing the same reading.
I just made a 2.5 G experimental batch of 1805 Barklay Perkins PA
Basically the same recipe - 2 row and bitter hopped to the bejeezus with Kent.
I'll keg and carb this weekend.
Pattinson has a great book and a great blog.
 
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Offline Ck27

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Re: Style question
« Reply #4 on: November 23, 2017, 12:24:46 PM »
Sounds like an 1800's Mild or Pale/Bitter. Those early beers often used just pale malt and one hop... more times than not Kent Golding.

I just transcribed a recipe, courtesy Ron Pattinson, from his brew logs that was 100% UK pale malt and 100% Golding hops. It was a Barclay Perkins 1837 XX Ale. That sounds pretty much what you just made.

You won't find any modern beer style guidelines that recognize a pale, hoppy, strong ABV mild but that's what they used to be. I studied Ron's blog and his books and crafted my own style guidelines to match the beers brewed between 1830 and 1900 and added them to my Beersmith software. I currently only have them for milds but I just began working on a Porter/Stout style guide last night.

I've been working on old recipies like you have ask Baron here lol he's been my guinea pig for testing.

Offline brewn

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Re: Style question
« Reply #5 on: November 25, 2017, 10:04:44 PM »
Thanks for the replies.

So here are the numbers BS came up with off my recipe.

All Grain (5.00 gal) ABV: 5.16 %
OG: 1.055 SG FG: 1.015 SG
IBUs: 32.3 IBUs Color: 4.4 SRM

Once the batch is ready, I do plan on sitting down with the BJCP and seeing what I might come up with.  That being said, if I produced a Mild unexpectedly, I'm ok with it.
Guessing I need to do some research on Ron Pattinson (please don't flog me).

Offline Kevin58

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Re: Style question
« Reply #6 on: November 26, 2017, 07:04:02 PM »
...  That being said, if I produced a Mild unexpectedly, I'm ok with it.


One thing you will learn from Ron is that the BJCP is the devil... in his opinion. One of the reasons I began making my own style guidelines is that they have the Mild category 100% wrong. Historically speaking. The original milds were not "mild" in anything. They were high ABV, light in color and sometimes highly hopped. The term "mild" only meant that the beer was served young or without aging.

Good luck.
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Online Oginme

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Re: Style question
« Reply #7 on: November 27, 2017, 05:55:21 AM »
The BJCP is a guide to help organize competitions.  It is not the be-all-or-end-all with regard to beer styles.  Some people take it much too seriously in terms of what it represents. 

I brew a few recipes that are definitely 'tweeners', that is between a couple of styles but not fitting neatly into either one.  I like the beers, but would never enter them into competition, as I know they will not get a good mark since they do not fit either of the style which I would enter them.  I've had enough seasoned craft brewers and drinkers taste them to get some feedback on any flaws or improvements and to confirm the flavor profiles I perceive from the beers, that I feel comfortable with them as being a sound recipe/brew.

Looking at the stats and the recipe, I would agree with a 'historical mild' as a possibly a good fit for your beer. 
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Offline brewn

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Re: Style question
« Reply #8 on: November 27, 2017, 10:24:00 PM »
I have no intention of entering it into a competition. Or really any of my other one for that matter. Been brewing for about 3 years now and I'm finding more interest in making something that tastes good to me and my friends and not so much following specific guidelines. I don't mind coloring outside of the lines every now and then. I was just curious at the beginning of this thread what my selection in BS be. But the thread has become far more interesting and informative.
The difficult thing now after having sampled it going to secondary is the waiting for it to be done.
Patience is a bitch sometimes.

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Re: Style question
« Reply #9 on: November 28, 2017, 05:44:06 AM »
Sorry for misreading your intentions.  I am of the opinion that the BJCP styles are descriptive and not proscriptive.  I was at a brewery this past weekend and tasted their "Marzen" which was waay too hoppy for the style.  I commented to the brewer who was present about it and he just shrugged saying, "It is what we came up with that people seemed to like."
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Re: Style question
« Reply #10 on: November 28, 2017, 10:27:51 AM »
Sorry for misreading your intentions.  I am of the opinion that the BJCP styles are descriptive and not proscriptive.  I was at a brewery this past weekend and tasted their "Marzen" which was waay too hoppy for the style.  I commented to the brewer who was present about it and he just shrugged saying, "It is what we came up with that people seemed to like."

This is kind of off-subject, but I?m reading a book by Terry Foster titled Brewing Porters and Stouts and Terry points out on several occasions that brewers have a tendency to trample all over BJCP yet use the particular style name in the description of their brew claiming they ?sell a lot of it?.  The general public has no idea. I use the BJCP guidelines for recipe formulation only.  But the bottom line is my beer has to be enjoyable.
« Last Edit: November 28, 2017, 10:37:26 AM by KellerBrauer »

Offline Ck27

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Re: Style question
« Reply #11 on: November 28, 2017, 12:28:06 PM »
Sorry for misreading your intentions.  I am of the opinion that the BJCP styles are descriptive and not proscriptive.  I was at a brewery this past weekend and tasted their "Marzen" which was waay too hoppy for the style.  I commented to the brewer who was present about it and he just shrugged saying, "It is what we came up with that people seemed to like."

This is kind of off-subject, but I?m reading a book by Terry Foster titled Brewing Porters and Stouts and Terry points out on several occasions that brewers have a tendency to trample all over BJCP yet use the particular style name in the description of their brew claiming they ?sell a lot of it?.  The general public has no idea. I use the BJCP guidelines for recipe formulation only.  But the bottom line is my beer has to be enjoyable.

I stick within style guidelines pretty much 100% of the time

Offline brewn

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Re: Style question
« Reply #12 on: November 28, 2017, 01:29:03 PM »
Sorry for misreading your intentions. 

You're fine. Sorry if I came across as rude. If there is anything I've learned over the past couple of years is that even though there are the guidelines, we're not required to only make Bud Lite. We as Home Brewers can make what ever the hell we want, however we want. That being said, if we're asked what kind of beer it is we should be able to say with confidence that "it resembles a (blank) style"

Maybe we just have the BJCP changed to have just a few simpler styles: Good, Great, Not a Fan, and Oh hell no. ;D


Offline brewn

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Re: Style question
« Reply #13 on: December 02, 2017, 01:01:15 PM »
So attached is the final results of my "style in question" brew. I don't mess with water PH because our water here in Kitsap County in Washing State is pretty good. So I don't log anything regarding it. My efficiency was higher than I had expected which I'm pretty happy about. I'm guessing with what info you guys have provided me and my numbers, I might have just come up with an old Mild.

 

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