Author Topic: Halving recipe changes properties in BeerSmith Software  (Read 16802 times)

Offline anak85

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Re: Halving recipe changes properties in BeerSmith Software
« Reply #30 on: February 17, 2019, 11:20:20 AM »
The first thing I would recommend is to try batch sparging.  If the batch sparge brings your efficiency up by a good margin, then it would suggest that you have some channeling of the sparge water in your fly sparge so the water is bypassing much of the grains.

If the batch sparge does not help much, then it comes down to the standard factors which control mash efficiency:

1.  Crush
2.  Crush
3.  Crush
4.  Crush
5.  Crush
6.  Poor wetting of grains when doughing in causing dough balls which are protected from the water and enzymes.  Mix the heck out of the grains when doughing in.  I mean like 5 to 10 minutes of stirring!
7.  Mash pH is waaay out of the prime conversion zone of 5.2 to 5.6 pH (at room temperature).
8.  Work to minimize process losses (loss of volume + sugar = poor efficiency)
9.  Check your thermometer to make sure it is accurate
10. Check and calibrate your hydrometer and/or refractometer

Normally, most issues are solved with steps 1 through 6.  If your brewing water is very hard, it may be difficult for the pH to drop down to the ideal range for enzyme activity to convert the starches into sugars.  Hope this helps some.

I just had my next brew day and had much better BHE results. 79%! I bought my own mill and crushed the grains myself. Also I spent a lot more time stirring the mash at the beginning and a second time after 20 minutes of mashing.

Thanks for your support :)

The BeerSmith Software does not quite correctly predict my water retention in the mashed grain. It is almost exactly 0,82L per kg grain and the BeerSmith predicted 0,94L / kg. How would you change that?

Offline Oginme

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Re: Halving recipe changes properties in BeerSmith Software
« Reply #31 on: February 17, 2019, 01:12:25 PM »
You can change the water absorption rate by clicking on 'options' > 'advanced' > 'grain absorption'.  Note that there are two values -- the first for standard brewing and the second for BIAB brewing. 
Recycle your grains, feed them to a goat!

Offline anak85

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Re: Halving recipe changes properties in BeerSmith Software
« Reply #32 on: February 17, 2019, 02:13:37 PM »
You can change the water absorption rate by clicking on 'options' > 'advanced' > 'grain absorption'.  Note that there are two values -- the first for standard brewing and the second for BIAB brewing.

Thanks. Which is the one to change?

0,82 L / kg is 27,73 fl oz / 35,3 oz -> 0,78555 fl oz / oz Is that correct? The grain absorption is set to 0,9600 and the BIAB grain absorption is set to 0,5860 currently.

And where do I set it if it is standard or BIAB? Is that done by ticking the little box in the mash profile?

Offline Oginme

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Re: Halving recipe changes properties in BeerSmith Software
« Reply #33 on: February 17, 2019, 02:16:54 PM »
If your mash profile has the box checked as a full volume BIAB mash, then you want to change the BIAB value.  Otherwise, change the standard grain absorption value.
Recycle your grains, feed them to a goat!

Offline anak85

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Re: Halving recipe changes properties in BeerSmith Software
« Reply #34 on: February 17, 2019, 02:39:31 PM »
If your mash profile has the box checked as a full volume BIAB mash, then you want to change the BIAB value.  Otherwise, change the standard grain absorption value.

Great, thanks! Now my values in the recipe are spot on with the results I got. Finally getting closer to the real world and can start copying recipes to my system.

I brewed this one today and thankfully it stated the brewhouse efficiency they calculated with. http://brulosophy.com/recipes/tiny-bottom-pale-ale/

How do you go about to copying recipes when the efficiency is not stated anywhere? Just try and hit the numbers (% alc. / IBU / colour) with your system?

Offline Oginme

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Re: Halving recipe changes properties in BeerSmith Software
« Reply #35 on: February 17, 2019, 05:13:08 PM »
There are too many recipes out there where the authors thoughtlessly do not express the efficiency for which they designed the recipe.  Most often, publications will standardize a recipe on a certain percent.  I believe the AHA uses 70% total efficiency and BYO is at 65%.  For others the best way is to use my force fit method described below.

1.  Open up a recipe template with your equipment profile,

2.  Enter the recipe EXACTLY as it is printed or written.  BeerSmith helps in that you can enter in the exact weight and the units and it will convert to your preferred units.  For example, I use Kg and grams for malts and hops respectively.  I can enter in the weight of '1.5 oz' and the program will automatically convert this to grams when I hit enter,

3.  Using the sliders below the design box, click on the Est Orginal Gravity slider and a box will pop up.  Fill in the target OG from the recipe.  The program will adjust the weights of the grains to scale for that gravity target,
 
4.  Do the same thing with IBU and color.  Note that the hop scaling will not affect any hop addition which does not contribute to IBU, such as dry hops.  For these, I scale according the the ratio of the volumes between the printed recipe and my target batch size.
Recycle your grains, feed them to a goat!

Offline anak85

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Re: Halving recipe changes properties in BeerSmith Software
« Reply #36 on: February 18, 2019, 04:09:37 AM »
There are too many recipes out there where the authors thoughtlessly do not express the efficiency for which they designed the recipe.  Most often, publications will standardize a recipe on a certain percent.  I believe the AHA uses 70% total efficiency and BYO is at 65%.  For others the best way is to use my force fit method described below.

AHA / BYO?

1.  Open up a recipe template with your equipment profile,

2.  Enter the recipe EXACTLY as it is printed or written.  BeerSmith helps in that you can enter in the exact weight and the units and it will convert to your preferred units.  For example, I use Kg and grams for malts and hops respectively.  I can enter in the weight of '1.5 oz' and the program will automatically convert this to grams when I hit enter,

Ohh wow, that is useful! I always mess about with the annoying converters. I'll give it a try.


3.  Using the sliders below the design box, click on the Est Orginal Gravity slider and a box will pop up.  Fill in the target OG from the recipe.  The program will adjust the weights of the grains to scale for that gravity target,
 
4.  Do the same thing with IBU and color.  Note that the hop scaling will not affect any hop addition which does not contribute to IBU, such as dry hops.  For these, I scale according the the ratio of the volumes between the printed recipe and my target batch size.

Thanks - that is very useful information!!

Also, I was told that I might have milled too fine. 0,6mm and that is probably why my water retension in the grain is so low at 0,78 fl / oz. Another user with the same setup has 0,84 fl oz / oz with a mill size of 1,2mm.

Since my grain was dripping very slowly I will go to the 1,2mm mill next time. I think I might have gotten lucky not to burn the kettle as it was only a 11L batch. Anything lager and the kettle might have run dry.

Offline Oginme

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Re: Halving recipe changes properties in BeerSmith Software
« Reply #37 on: February 18, 2019, 05:41:06 AM »
AHA = American Homebrewers Association
BYO = Brew Your Own (a popular home brewing magazine)

As far as your crush is concerned, as long as you did not get a stuck sparge or if you want to increase your run off rate then you don't need to change anything.  Unless you are seeing lots of shredded and cut hulls, or a lot of barley flour in your grist, I would not worry too much about it.

A finder crush will generally lead to slightly lower grain absorption rate, but the lower the grain absorption rate means the less sugars you are leaving behind in the mash tun.  There really is no 'correct' grain absorption number to target as it will vary from system to system and depends upon a number of factors related to mash liquor temperature, mean grain particle size, size distribution, amount of intact the hulls, grain bed depth, rate of drainage, amount of grain bed compaction, etc. 

Recycle your grains, feed them to a goat!

Offline BOB357

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Re: Halving recipe changes properties in BeerSmith Software
« Reply #38 on: February 18, 2019, 12:15:57 PM »
Gravity readings are taken at, or very close to , the calibration temperature of the hydrometer and adjusted to the actual temperature as needed. As you get further away from the calibration temperature the adjustment tables become less accurate.
Bob

Offline anak85

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Re: Halving recipe changes properties in BeerSmith Software
« Reply #39 on: February 19, 2019, 02:17:35 PM »
AHA = American Homebrewers Association
BYO = Brew Your Own (a popular home brewing magazine)

As far as your crush is concerned, as long as you did not get a stuck sparge or if you want to increase your run off rate then you don't need to change anything.  Unless you are seeing lots of shredded and cut hulls, or a lot of barley flour in your grist, I would not worry too much about it.

A finder crush will generally lead to slightly lower grain absorption rate, but the lower the grain absorption rate means the less sugars you are leaving behind in the mash tun.  There really is no 'correct' grain absorption number to target as it will vary from system to system and depends upon a number of factors related to mash liquor temperature, mean grain particle size, size distribution, amount of intact the hulls, grain bed depth, rate of drainage, amount of grain bed compaction, etc.

Perfect - thanks!!

 

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