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Interest in vendor specific grains listings?

BeerSmith

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Hello all!

 I'm thinking of entering a number of vendor specific grains and making them available for download.

 A few questions:

 - I have a number of US source grain data sheets, but any out of country ones would be helpful.

 - I will post any additions on the web - but how do you feel about adding them to the "general" database?  I have mixed feelings.  On one hand I think it would be great to have a large database, but on the other hand if the file gets very large it might just confuse new brewers.  Thoughts?

Cheers!
Brad
 
If by 'general' database, you mean the one that currently contains the other grains, extracts, and sugars, then I think that is exactly where it should go.  I think it would be more confusing to have some grains in one place and other grains somewhere else.  Great idea, BTW.
 
Pat,
 I guess what I'm debating is whether it should be part of the "standard" database, or just a separate file you can download and merge in as you like.

 If I merge it with the master database, it will go out to everyone automatically.

 If I don't, you can download only the grain manufacturers appropriate for your brewing area and merge those as you like.

Brad
 
Beyond base malts--pale, pilsner, maybe vienna/munich--what sorts of malts are you talking about? In my relatively limited experience, very few maltsters offer the same menu of malts as the next. Yes, you'll have British chocolate and domestic chocolate, or roasted barley, or the various crystal/caramel malts--but is there enough variability from one to the next to make it worthwhile?

Personally, I've already gone through the grain/hop listings and trashed ones that I know I will never need or buy. I find myself using the "Show In-Stock Items" flag most of the time, anyway.

I guess my feeling is that for the newcomer to BeerSmith and to brewing in general, less is more. Many new brewers (at least, I know this applies to me) are overwhelmed by the plethora of different grains, sugars, hops, yeasts, and so on that can be used to brew beer. Once enough experience has been gained, a brewer will seek out some of the more "advanced" ingredients with which to brew. Throwing them into the mix in the beginning is simply going to confuse most new(er) brewers. They'll come back and find information on those grains independently, and as needed. Besides, the list is going to be constantly changing/growing, so a standard list one day is not going to be the same as it may be the next.

Anyway, my fraction of a dollar  :D
 
I'd rather not have them as part of the current grain selection.  In fact, I've wondered if there's a way I can remove some of the ones in there now but be able to add them back later.  Not a manual delete/add routine, but more of an export to a file (to import later if needed) or drag and drop to a folder.  It may be do-able now and I've just not figured it out as I haven't tried very hard as of yet.

 Ricky
 
I see nothing wrong with having them available as a download for those that want them.  I have tended to thin out the list rather than add to it...but let everyong choose what they want.  I would also suggest more info on the extracts for those that want it.
Van
 
Brad,

I, for one, would love to see vender specific information in the grains list.  It isn't that big a deal to scroll through the list of grains and I would assume that all from a specific manufacturer would be grouped together.  I believe it would add one more level of intricacy to the recipe construction.  I am always experimenting with grains from different malting companies and this feature would save me some time.  I also think that even a beginner would be able to pick a vender specific grain from a list.  If they were using a preconstructed recipe kit, it would possibly even eliminate the confusion of finding which particular grain to enter into their recipe and might even yield more accurate results.

Ken
 
Thanks for all of the input so far...

I'm going to most likely make these separate downloads.  This seems to provide the greatest flexibility.

If you choose you can easily import them into the main grain database using the "Import and Merge" command  on the File menu.  Alternately you can open the file and just cut and paste the ones you want.

 I welcome additional opinions!

Cheers!
Brad
 
Brad--I think what you're suggesting is the best way to go, if only for one major reason--the Remove from Inventory command! I use this feature religiously to keep track of what I have available, should I decide at the last minute to brew something. Already on a couple of occasions have I accidentally created a recipe using the wrong malt--usually doing something like selecting US Pale instead of UK Pale. Obviously, I know what pale malt I have, but the program doesn't. Yeah, it's just dumb user error, but at least in my case, having fewer variables to concern myself with is a good thing.

By all means, make the various grains/hops/whatever available for download, but don't overload the existing database. I know that I, for one, will add to the database should I find grains that aren't listed, but I wouldn't expect every BeerSmith user everywhere to be faced with listings of grains that may not be available to them.
 
Thanks!
 Seems to be a consensus forming here...other thoughts?

Brad
 
>other thoughts?

Would it be difficult to have another category (or folder) that had a list of ingredients that do not show up when I click on grains in the recipe edit screen, but I could drag and drop from the current "Grains and Extracts" (and hops/yeast/etc) group to this "warehouse" (bad name) group?

I'd like to be able to have a smaller list of grains & extracts (and hops/yeast/etc.) that I normally use and see when I am working on a recipe, but be able to drag and drop between this "warehouse" group and my smaller list that shows up in the recipe screen.

In other words, I'd rather have a smaller list of what I normally use show up in the grain/hops/yeast list, but to get that I'd have to delete the others (best I can tell).  Then, should I decide I want to use one of those I deleted, I'd have to reenter them all over again.  I can claim I have all of the ones of interest in stock and then use the "in stock" checkbox, but then I can't use that check-box to show what I really have in stock.

Not a biggie, but you did ask for other thoughts -  :)

 Ricky
 
Ricky,
 I've been toying for some time with the idea of a "hide" flag for the database items.  You would be able to "hide" items you don't use very much, but then still be able to access them or "unhide" them later.

 This would allow you to eliminate seldom used items without really deleting them.  You might be able to see hidden items using a special filter on the current view or something like that.

 I have not implemented this yet, but what do you think of this idea?

Cheers!
Brad
 
My only worry is that to change one from hidden to unhidden, I'd have to unhide all the hidden ones, then go through and hide again all the ones I had hidden except the one or two I wanted to add in.

If it had a "display all" toggle that would show both "hidden" and "unhidden" items, then let me change an individual items tag from hidden to unhidden, then toggle the "display all" off and go back to just showing the "unhidden" items, it should serve what I'm after perfectly.  Thanks.

 Ricky
 
Yes,
 I'm thinking of a menu checkbox that lets you "display all" along with a item by item flag to mark them hidden if desired.

Cheers!
Brad
 
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