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Searching for Clear Beer

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dnd0327

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Hey All, new to the forum, apologies if this topic has been covered. I'm on about 20 AG batches and I have only had 1 that was clear. I thought time was my issue, so my last 2 batches sat in secondary for 4 weeks each...still cloudy. Don't get me wrong, they taste GREAT!! I'm just thinking for competition stuff it would be nice...I use Irish moss and significant time. Any other suggestions?? Thanks, Dan
 
do you do a mashout? I raise the water temperature to 170F and let it set for 15 minuets. This seems to help me? There are clarifier's for post fermentation. Last bet is to brew dark beers!!
 
When do you add Irish Moss?

What is the storage Temp?

I use either Irish moss or Whirlflock at 10 - 15 minutes left in the boil.
I use a primary fermenter for 10 days, then xfer to a keg and "crash" the beer to 40f.  Rapidly dropping the temp helps drop out the haze forming proteins.  I also force carbonate at 35 PSI for a couple days.
All by beers clear in a week or so.
 
Hey guys, thanks for the reply.
I do not do a mashout, I go straight to sparge, which I do at about 168 deg.
I add irish moss with 10 min left.
I can't crash here in Maine until October time frame, and I don't keg yet.
Maybe bottle condditioning is doing it?
It's really a minor issue, everyone that tastes has not problem with it.
I was just thinking that a profile will call for clarity in competition and I need to get there.

Thanks a bunch,
Dan


 
If you chill the bottles to the low 40s or less after carbonation is complete, you might find the haze forming compounds drop out with the yeast. 

I know it is not a big deal for you but you could filter before bottle conditioning.  Seems like a waste to me but I know folks who do for special occasion brews.

JOe
 
Thanks Jomebrew,
I will definately keep that in mind for special occasions.
 
Is it cloudy all the time, or only when chilled? 
Regardless of yeast strain? 

Try to reach boil ASAP for better hot break.  Water chemistry matters.  What is your calcium level?
How do you chill?  Do that ASAP for better cold break.  Chill to pitching temperature. 

If you rely on ambient water temps to cool, try a sump pump to push ice water through your chiller.

Try whirlfoc if IM is not working for you.

Do you recycle some wort before you start collecting?  Until particle free and less cloudy?
 
i like to use some gelatin in the secondary it works wonders.
 
Hey Maltlicker,

Is it cloudy all the time, or only when chilled? ---Seems clear until chilled---
Regardless of yeast strain? ---Yes---

Try to reach boil ASAP for better hot break. ---boil usually reached within 10 min on 100 btu burner---

Water chemistry matters.  What is your calcium level? ---Not sure---

How do you chill?  Do that ASAP for better cold break. 
Chill to pitching temperature. ---usually 5-8 min for pitching temp--- 

If you rely on ambient water temps to cool,
try a sump pump to push ice water through your chiller. ---my water runs about 55degF---

Try whirlfoc if IM is not working for you.---I just started with this, hoping for better results---

Thanks for the reply, much appreciated.
Cheers,
Dan

 
Hey Crabbs,

i like to use some gelatin in the secondary it works wonders. ---i have tried it, on very light beers it seems to work, but anything above pale ale it seems to not...for me anyway---

Thanks a bunch,
Dan
 
I'm going with whirfloch tablets to see if that makes a difference. The only other option I can see is either using gelatin for light beers or a refrigerator for slightly darker beers. Obviously for anything darker than a brown ale, I don't care.

Thanks for all the replies,
Dan
 
Hey all, thanks for all the replies. My beer is clear at room temp!! I never thought to look for chill haze, because I have never had it. This is new to me. I have several methods to fix this problem, all of which I will try starting now. Thanks for all the help, you guys are the best!!
Dan
 
dnd0327 said:
Is it cloudy all the time, or only when chilled? ---Seems clear until chilled---

Try to reach boil ASAP for better hot break. ---boil usually reached within 10 min on 100 btu burner---

Chill to pitching temperature. ---usually 5-8 min for pitching temp---  
Click to expand...

If you're boiling and chilling that quickly, then I'd suspect water is deficient in calcium and perhaps magnesium.  Calcium esp. is helpful to break out the proteins.  

www.wardlab.com can give you a complete read on your water for $17 or so.  Once you know what you got, Palmer sheet and BeerSmith can help figure out additions.

EDIT - One other thought is the length of the mash.  Are you mashing long enough to allow for full conversion of all the starches?  Perhaps trying mashing for an extra 30 minutes and see if that makes a difference. 
 
Thanks Maltlicker,
I sent my water sample out today. That's a great price compared to labs around here!
Dan
 
Got my water report back, any suggestions?

pH 8.0
Total Dissolved Solids (TDS) Est, ppm - 178
Electrical Conductivity, mmho/cm - 0.30
Cations / Anions, me/L - 2.4 / 2.3

Sodium, Na - 35
Potassium, K - 3
Calcium, Ca - 13
Magnesium, Mg - 2
Total Hardness, CaCO3 - 41
Nitrate, NO3-N - 0.8 (SAFE)
Sulfate, SO4-S - 3
Chloride, Cl - 54
Carbonate, CO3 - 3
Bicarbonate, HCO3 - 26
Total Alkalinity, CaCO3 - 27

Any input is appreciated.
Thanks
Dan
 
www.howtobrew.com

I think chapter 3.15 is the water chemistry section.  Use the site map. 

Like mine, low in calcium and magnesium, which are basic to yeast performance regardless of style.  10X the Magnesium and Calcium every batch is not crazy advice.

Almost no sulfates, so add for anything hoppy. 

Fairly low carbonates/alkalinity, so likely need some baking soda for dark roasted grains. 

Palmer's great on this stuff.  Take it on gradually, starting with the calcium and magnesium.  The calcium will vastly improve hot and cold break. 
 
Excellent stuff Maltlicker,
These details only enhance my joy of our craft. I love these little problems that force you to learn a whole lot about a specific brewing topic.

Thanks for the input, my chill haze problems are getting clearer.
Have you ever used 5.2 ph stabilizer?
Does this help water chem?

Regards,
Dan
 
My understanding of 5.2 is that it is some type buffering agent that helps the pH "stick" in the desired 5.2 to 5.5 range.  So, if you're having problems related to not being in that range, and you're willing to do only one additive to try to fix it, 5.2 is a good option.

However, 5.2 does not add the calcium/magnesium, nor does it address the RA, or the chloride/sulfate ratio, so it is not the one-step solution to water chemistry tinkering. 
 
You can work with those numbers ,yu ough 

pH 7.8
Total Dissolved Solids (TDS) Est 278
Electrical Conductivity, mmho/cm 0.46
Cations / Anions, me/L 5.0 / 4.8
ppm
Sodium, Na 5
Potassium, K 1
Calcium, Ca 73
Magnesium, Mg 14
Total Hardness, CaCO3 241
Nitrate, NO3-N 6.5 (SAFE)
Sulfate, SO4-S 7
Chloride, Cl 9
Carbonate, CO3 < 1
Bicarbonate, HCO3 218
Total Alkalinity, CaCO3 179
Fluoride, F 0.03
Total Iron, Fe < 0.01
"<" - Not Detected / Below Detection Limitt

Bi carb and Alkalinty are way to high except for STOUTS lol
 
Water chemistry made no difference on 2 batches. I'm giving up on clear beer...
 
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