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Carbonation uses estimated volume

Myk

Grandmaster Brewer
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It would be much easier and make sense to base the carbonation level off the actual measured bottling volume. I can look at my carboy and see what that's going to be.

With some people lying about batch size to get the estimated gravity to match up with actual mash efficiency it has to really be screwing up their carbonation levels.
I seem to be lying about efficiency, claiming it is much better than it is, to get my predicted gravity to come out and it still doesn't come out with the right bottling volume for me all the time.

On this particular brew it took a long time of messing with assorted lies and guesses to get the estimated gravity and batch size to match up to actual.
If it wasn't for trying to get an average for new brew pot I wouldn't be doing it.
I definitely don't want to have to take all these measurements for every brew and then bounce around trying different lies to make things come out right.
It kind of removes the usefulness of using brewing software.

It would also be nice to put in the actual carbonation used and have the calculator figure it the other way like 1 had. In 2 I have to add the actual amount used to the notes because you can't add anything to the actual amount used.
 
Hi,
  It is on my "to-do" list to offer both (carbonation based on estimate as well as carbonation based on actual).  I've not finished it yet but will add it to a future version.

Brad
 
I use the Carbonation Tool to calculate how much DME to add rather than using what the recipe suggests. Based on the numbers I get, I believe the Carbonation Tool is providing the correct numbers for actual volume rather than estimated/predicted volume like the recipe does.

I would very much like to have the option to pick actual volume within the recipe for carbonation calculations, but for now, this method seems to be working for me.

Scott
 
I agree that I would very much like to be able to use the actual bottling volume rather than estimated.

 
Seem that BS2 still considers estimated insteaf of measured, how am I supposed to use the tool if my actual is different from estimated?
 
It seems that this problem quite old, but it hasn't been solved yet. Is there any estimated time before this gets updated?
 
So, why isn't everyone just going into their equipment profile and changing the fermenter loss field to match their actual loss?

It seems to me that making the profile match actual results is the whole point of it. Isn't that what it's for?
 
Because sometimes accidents happen and you don't get the usual results. In my case, for example, the screen in the brew pot detached, which caused hops clogging the cooler and a significant wort loss. Since the "measured post boil volume" field is there, I expected the carbonation quantities to be adjusted accordingly: i f I hadn't noticed the problem, I would probably have ended up with exploding bottles. Luckily, the carbonation tool helped me estimating the correct amount.
 
brewfun said:
So, why isn't everyone just going into their equipment profile and changing the fermenter loss field to match their actual loss?

It seems to me that making the profile match actual results is the whole point of it. Isn't that what it's for?

That would be too easy....  Actually, that is what I do.  Since I have my priming solution made up ahead of time, I just ratio the addition to the volume in the bottling bucket versus the expected volume.
 
mikonapoli said:
Because sometimes accidents happen and you don't get the usual results.

Ya don't say!! That's a new one.... ;)

The equipment profile in each recipe is saved separate from the mash database AND separate from every other recipe. In the recipe tab, click on the check mark next to the equipment profile name (and any other profile, if you want) and it'll open a popup window.

Now, change loss to trub, batch size and/or the fermenter loss field to reflect that actual recipe. If you have the actual batch size and OG on the Fermentation tab, you'll also see the "Actual Efficiency" number. Use this to modify the Brewhouse Efficiency number on either the recipe tab, or in the recipe's equipment profile.

BeerSmith's numbers will change accordingly.

If you have a bit more fermenter loss than anticipated, simply change that field in the recipe's equipment profile. The recipe will update with the new sugar amount.
 
Thanks. A major screw-ups happened this time, so volume was not the only badly missed :). Anyway, I find that the easiest thing to do is to use the separate carbonation tool (so I don't have to tinker with the equipment too much).
I just suggest that in the "fermentation" tab of the recipe the fact that amount of fermentable to be added is computed from the recipe (or at least not from the "measured" values) should be stressed out somewhere in the interface to avoid CO2 bombs to clumsy users like me :)
 
I do think that this behavior is inclining to the "bug-like" behaviour. I mean, in 90% I want to compute the carbonation on the measured value and not on some computed value. I'm using it in the brewlogs, mostly. Changing the trub/loss values to match the actual computed value is for me an ugly workaround (if not a hack;)).

Only situation I can imagine one would like to now the priming weight for computed values is when designing the recipe, to know some estimate weight one would need.
 
Dodes said:
I do think that this behavior is inclining to the "bug-like" behaviour. I mean, in 90% I want to compute the carbonation on the measured value and not on some computed value. I'm using it in the brewlogs, mostly. Changing the trub/loss values to match the actual computed value is for me an ugly workaround (if not a hack;)).

Only situation I can imagine one would like to now the priming weight for computed values is when designing the recipe, to know some estimate weight one would need.

I'm not quite sure I understand how this is a work-around.  Do you want the software to know how much you actually got without having to enter the actual trub loss value?  The program estimates the amount of priming sugar needed  for carbonation based upon the inputs from the equipment profile.  Giving it actual numbers that reflect what you achieved is not what I would call a 'work around.'
 
The problem is that it isn't specified anywhere if the value should be computed from either pre-computed values or measured values of the recipe/brewlog (and another complication is that the same dialog is used for recipes and brewlogs and some values are valid for recipes, others for the brewlogs).

The label says "Carbonation used". I take it as it telling me the amount I should use for carbonating the beer I've brew. So this number should be computed from the *measured* values IMHO. If the label was "Estimated carbonation", no one could argue about it then.
 
I don't know whether to put my two cents worth in this post or not, but here goes. It's very true that every brewer should try to adjust the equipment profiles to match the estimates brewing software calculates. When accidents happen, (god knows I've had plenty) it would be nice to just change the measured bottling volume in the fermentation tab and have it adjust the priming sugar or DME accordingly. Having carbonation figured solely off of bottling volume estimates, just don't make sense to me. You can have several batches in a row that hit mash eff, brewhouse eff rite on the estimates, then one comes around that efficiency higher or lower. Several things can be done to correct this dilute, dilute with water DME, have more beer :) have less beer :( . Me I'm lazy I just go for the more or less beer and if I'm not kegging manually figure the priming sugar.   
 
Another thread of people with similar views.

Here's my story:

Glad I found this thread.

The "Carbonation Used" feature looked ideal, but just caused me a real headache.

I carbonated based on this value, but split my batch in two.  Having entered 'Bottling Volume' into the available field I, evidently, ended up with almost double the priming sugar.

Oh dear.
You live, you learn.  You learn how to make use of 120 bottles of gushers.

When is this feature going to be resolved?
 
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