Bottles in a Dishwasher

For years, I had been rinsing out my bottles immediately after use and air drying. I would check the bottom of the bottle and make sure it was clear. On bottle day, I would use my Star San to sanitize and then fill each one up and cap. Until one day, I noticed a ring around one of my bottle necks. How could this be? I went ahead and checked my bottles the next time I was to rack beer into them and found mold and gunk. I was surprised since I rinse each bottle out thoroughly until it's clean at the bottom. I checked my other empties, that I hadn't used in a while, and found more gunk. Clearly, I wasn't cleaning them enough.

From this point forward, I started to place a bottle in the dishwasher after using it. I would immediately rinse it out and place it in the washer for the next cycle. After this, they would go into a box until I was to fill them up. On bottle, day, they'd go in my Star San, etc. Since then, I have not had any moldy bottle issues.

I made a hefeweizen this summer that had absolutely no head retention. Fully carbonated, but head would dissipate within a minute. I didn't think anything of it, until I read that placing your drinking glasses in the dishwasher can destroy head retention. This didn't solve the issue for me as I started washing my glasses by hand. But now I'm thinking am I destroying my head retention because I've been placing my bottles in the dishwasher? I started doing this in May and here's what's happened (brew month in parenthetical):

American IPA (June): great retention
Belgian Wit (June): great retention
Hefeweizen (June): absolutely no retention---three finger head on pour, gone immediately
Oktoberfest (July): not much to no retention (I know it's supposed to be a lager, but I use ale yeast)
American IPA (August): some retention

The Oktoberfest has just been tapped so it might be considered young but I've made this in the past and have had no issues with retention. It's possible it needs some time and that it might not be fully carbonated (been in the bottle two weeks). I have a Belgian Dubbel on deck, which could be telling in this regard that was brewed back in August but I'm not cracking that till the middle of October (by that time it will have been in bottle for a month).

I'm not using any rinse agent in my dishwasher, just detergent. Should I stray from washing my bottles in the dishwasher? And if so, what can I do to keep them clean? Should I literally wash by hand with soap? Or is PBW the way to go?

  I use a home brew bottle spray rinser that goes on your  laundry tub taps and a plastic sulfite reservoir hand pump sanitizer. Rinse-sanitize- rinse well and drain. It usually works. Lots of guys use the dishwasher and love it; I personally cant see those sprays going through a skinny bottle mouth and getting the entire bottom clean which is 4 times as wide. Even my pilsner glasses don't come entirely clean and some end up with gunk inside the bottom that wasn't there before they went in there.  I find a strong light inspection ( halogen worklamp) reveals residues left behind when you think it's clean, a lot of heavier gravity beers and dark beers may leave a residue that only a bottle brush will remove. Hang the lamp about 4 feet high on the wall and hold each bottle up to it to look. You may a find a few bottles that you were going to fill need further cleaning with a brush.  I only bottle about 14- 500 ml poly bottles at a time as I make 46 liters and keg 38, so it's worth it for me to inspect every one.  Your head retention in my opinion will suffer from the dishwasher due to silicates residue from the gel soap, many others swear it won"t. Whatever works for you. CHEERS.
PS My hefeweizen head doesn't last long either, I think due to phenolic compounds from the special yeast.

When I used to bottle my beer I'd put my empties in a bucket with a fairly strong bleach solution in it. This would sanitize them, get rid of any rings, as well as labels. Then when it came time to use them all they really needed was a good rinse in clean water. Some needed to be brushed, but most were fine just like that.

twhitaker said:

  I use a home brew bottle spray rinser that goes on your  laundry tub taps and a plastic sulfite reservoir hand pump sanitizer.

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I used to have this for my carboys. I'll have to look into it. Great idea (always thought it was for carboys).

Maine Homebrewer said:

When I used to bottle my beer I'd put my empties in a bucket with a fairly strong bleach solution in it.

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This is actually what I use to clean my primary fermentors to get ride of the krausen rings---soak overnight (2oz bleach to 5 gallons cold water). It does the job. To clean the dirty bottles that grew gunk over time, I actually tried an oxyclean to loosen everything. Worked wonders. I spent a ton of time after that rinsing it out completely, though.

Thanks for the help guys.

This is actually what I use to clean my primary fermentors to get ride of the krausen rings---soak overnight (2oz bleach to 5 gallons cold water).

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I haven't used cleanser or bleach on my glass carboys in a long time.  At this point I just use hot water and a brush. Do that immediately and the stuff comes right off. Let it dry and then hit it with the spray bottle filled with StarSan. Cap it with foil and it's ready for the next batch.

In general I've used the dishwasher as my go to.  Like you, rinse the sediment out & run through the dishmasher.  I've not noticed problems either with my bottles or my glassware.

If you continue to have issues, I think I'd recommend experimenting with PBW.  Try six bottles cleaned w/PBW and six from the dishmasher.  Put them side by side in the fridge and pour one of each at the same time (in clean glassware).

If your dishwasher allows for it you should turn off any rinse agent function. The chemicals used as rinse agents reduce the surface tension of water to give you that spot free look. After drying there is always some residue of the rinse agent in the bottle. This can affect head retention. Some dishwashers allow you to turn that part of the cycle off.

i just place bottles in dishwasher without soap on hot cycle - bottles get sanitized then i dip them again in starsan then bottle - so far so good - maybe you hed retention issue may have to do with other factors (grain bill / Temps / etc.) maybe you are not adding enough sugar. i just saying it may not just be bottles since some of your beers do not have same issue.