Hops and pre boil volume

brewprint said:

If you guys don't agree, and for the most part automatically disagree with my conclusion, then it just kind of defeats the purpose of the forum.

The reason that I made this post on here was because I thought there was something missing and I just didn't see it, as I've done before. I see now that's actually not the case.

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I don't disagree with either your conclusion or your desire to see the software make a compensation. Yet, there are a lot of other places where BeerSmith and every other program make very broad assumptions and people still get accurate results. BeerSmith has always dealt with these types of losses in the trub number. Other programs may deal with it differently, but both end up in the same place.

BeerSmith doesn't account for moisture content in grain, or liquid loss from yeast. There is no calculation for beer absorbed by yeast or volume loss from CO2 and alcohol lamination.

What does happen is that brewers change the batch size and loss assumptions to cover a broad swath of circumstances. Thus, we end up with 5.5 gallon batch sizes for a 5 gallon yield. Seems to work. In my case, I look for 17.1 barrels in a fermenter to get a 15 barrel yield. Adding dry hops is an assumed loss of 1 gallon per pound. My yield just goes down, I don't look to add water way back at the beginning of the process.

I think your observations in other threads about pH and water chemistry are on-point and much higher priorities.

Since I introduced the 5.12 oz./oz. of hops that heated up this thread, I thought it fit to add that I don't calculate losses to hop debris, whether I use a spider or just chunk the pellets in. I set my batch size to 6.0 gallons to brew a 5.5 gallon batch so I can be assured of 5.5 gallons of clear wort into the fermenter. If I end up with some extra it can go into a 1 gallon fermenter or be canned as starter wort.

Following this thread got me to thinking (ouch!). In the process of dialing in my equipment profiles I measured the various losses in the process, as I assume most of you did. Among those losses were kettle loss due to trub. I never really thought how much hop debris, and the liquid it was suspended in contributed to the volume I entered. If we had 3 or 4 oz. of hops in the batches we measured the kettle loss from, it greatly reduces the volumes being discussed here.

Also, what goes into the fermenter varies greatly from brewer to brewer. All the way from running only clean wort to dumping everything in. In the end, each of us have found what works for us and our setup. While I do support input to Brad, I really think this subject would be better addressed by individuals to fit their systems and processes. The losses are similar to boil off change when the humidity takes a big swing, and we don't usually think much about relative humidity before calculating water volumes. Just my opinion.

If you feel it important enough, it's simple enough to just add a set amount of sparge water/oz. of hops above what was included with kettle loss or suck up the loss in your packaging volume. In any event, it has been an interesting discussion leaving us an opportunity to do some experimentation.