• Welcome to the new forum! We upgraded our forum software with a host of new boards, capabilities and features. It is also more secure.
    Jump in and join the conversation! You can learn more about the upgrade and new features here.

Dry Stout recipe in Beersmith

kgs

Apprentice
Joined
May 25, 2009
Messages
18
Reaction score
0
Location
Florida
Beersmith comes with a sample set of recipes that includes one by Brad Smith for Dry Stout. (Stray thought: BeerXML needs a few additional fields, like an absolute identifier for a specific recipe -- something more specific than the NAME tag. I apologize for that digression.)

I am a new brewer (this is my 9th batch) and in making this beer, in retrospect, two things stood out. The first was the lack of roasted barley. The second was the total size of the grain bill, 8 lbs., which in comparing this with other recipes seemed very low. After talking with my local homebrew store I tweaked the grain bill to reduce the flaked barley and add in roasted barley. I made this as a half-batch (2.5 gallons), so my recipe ended up: 2.5 lbs 2-row, .5 lbs flaked barley, .5 lbs black barley, .5 lbs roasted barley (in other words, 4 lbs of grain), 1.25 oz East Kent Goldings, 1/4 tsp Irish Moss, and 1 package Danstar Windsor yeast (recommended by my homebrew store instead of the Irish Ale yeast specified in the recipe because this time of year my "beer closet" is very slightly warmer than desirable).

The OG was 1.38 (on the nose!) but fermentation seemed wussy... lots of airlock activity for a few hours, but not the really vigorous snowglobe fermentation I have seen with my other batches, and then things got very quiet. Very thin layer of krausen; evidence of a yeast cake on the bottom but not that thick sludge I've had for other batches. Four days later, I took a reading and it was 1.018--better than I feared, but still not great. Tastes nice, but not as dry as I was shooting for. Maybe things will lower in the next week... the recipe calls for 11 days fermentation.

Is that recipe correct? It is one of the lowest grain bills (by percent of total volume) I have seen for a beer recipe. Also, why no roasted barley in the original? Is it possible it was left out and the total grain bill should really be a pound or two higher?

 
Hi,
  Yes it is - I've brewed it dozens of times now and it comes out great every time.  The original Guinness also has a very low OG.  The black barley (stout roast) is actually more appropriate to the style than roasted barley as it gives the appropriate dry flavor.  A pound is more than enough to give appropriate color and flavor.  Flaked barley gives it body.

  I don't know why your FG is so high - could be the mashing process or any number of things.

Cheers,
Brad
 
The flaked, black, and roasted together is 37% of your grist, lowering the PPG and fermentability somewhat.  To compensate, the mash temp recommended is usually 149/150F to help it dry out.  And if your beer closet temp fluctuates, perhaps a temp swing led to the yeast dropping out.  And Windsor is a quick fermenter.  Maybe try rousing it gently to keep it in suspension? 
 
MaltLicker said:
The flaked, black, and roasted together is 37% of your grist, lowering the PPG and fermentability somewhat.   To compensate, the mash temp recommended is usually 149/150F to help it dry out.  And if your beer closet temp fluctuates, perhaps a temp swing led to the yeast dropping out.  And Windsor is a quick fermenter.  Maybe try rousing it gently to keep it in suspension? 

Hmmm, will keep all this in mind. I picked the recipe because it was Brad Smith's and it commented that he made it a lot, so I do find it puzzling. The beer closet is actually fairly stable -- it's literally a closet, in a fairly cool part of the house. We don't keep the a/c maxed out in summer, but it shouldn't be really warm.

Thanks for the mashing notes, though I went by what's in the recipe. I may goose the carboy a bit.

Brad, thanks for the style notes. Once upon a decade I experienced Guinness on tap in England for a year and coming back to the U.S. it never really tasted right (always just off a bit -- though people here also serve it too cold), so I would like to get this one correct. I may even try a second thermometer just to see if I'm getting bad readings.
 
Thinking more about this, I've had several beers finish higher than I wanted, but they tasted "complete" or finished, as far as attenuation went.  There is a difference between residual sweetness from an incomplete ferm and a high FG from lots of crystal, black, roasted, etc.  I bet the FG will not be an issue.

As to matching the Guiness taste, Jamil recommends grinding the roasted to a powder to get that dry grainy flavor. 
 
MaltLicker said:
As to matching the Guiness taste, Jamil recommends grinding the roasted to a powder to get that dry grainy flavor. 

Yikes! I already had a stuck sparge to un-stick. (This was also a lesson in the limits of a 2-gallon mash tun -- I think 4 lbs is actually a bit much. 3.5 and less seems fine.)

I got up this morning and read the chapter on stout in Designing Great Beers, and I see where the homebrew store guy would question the recipe (yes, even though it's from Brad Smith :) ). "Due in large part to the AHA style definition, 12 of 13 dry and foreign stouts from the NHC second round include roast barley" (even though roast barley was only found in 60% of commercial samples). The homebrew store folks are not slaves to style -- they are very encouraging of playing around -- but I can still see where they might question a dry stout that doesn't have roast barley *qua* roast barley, versus black barley, just based on most recipes they've seen.

I may do this again in a week, this time per the original recipe, and possibly with a different yeast. This is all for fun and learning, after all... if I'm really desperate for beer I'm only 2 miles from a great store. :)

 
Back
Top