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Why is 60 minutes the default time for bittering hops
- Thread starter Wildrover
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Wildrover said:
Well, you can. I think 60 mins is the standard time for boiling wort drive off any DMS and to reach the preferred gravity for fermentation. 60 mins for hops just fell into this pattern. You can boil for 2 hours and add hops all along the way. Of course you will get different results with different additions at different times. Boiling any hops for over 30 min will drive off any aromatics and leave you only with bitterness.
Berkyjay said:
I think this is really what I was looking for. At what point do you utilize as much of the hop bitterness as you are going to get? It does look like after some point in time, it doesn't matter how much more you boil, you have gotten out of the hop what you are going to get. I, for some reason, figured that amount of time was 60 minutes but I was fooling with BeerSmith and changing bittering times and it seems like you will get more bitterness out of a hop addition if you boil for 90 minutes as opposed to 60, though not very much. But you will have the same hop bitterness out of an addition if you boil for 1000 minutes or only 200 minutes (at least according to BS). So, I'm sort of wondering at what point does boiling longer no longer really matter?
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Wildrover said:
Tinseth's model, the default in BSmith, uses the numbers at this link:
http://www.realbeer.com/hops/research.html
At 1.050, you only pick up 1% from 60 to 90, and another 1% from 90-120. Diminishing returns set in. It worsens as the gravity rises due to the "bigness factor" reducing utilization.
http://www.realbeer.com/hops/FAQ.html has info on the other models.
So, I'm guessing the formula becomes asymptotic. I'm guessing that even though I put in crazy boil times like 1000 minutes and 200 minutes and the utilization was the same, if I looked at the decimal about a thousand places out there might be a slight difference in the 1000 minute boil as opposed to the 200 minute boil.
Of course at this point, this conversation is really more out of curiosity than any practical home brewing significance. It is interesting though
Of course at this point, this conversation is really more out of curiosity than any practical home brewing significance. It is interesting though
ECarroll
Brewer
also do not forget,boiling up to and hour conservers your beer also, up to 6 months and longer.
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An anecdotal sample of one, but I once took gravity readings all during the boil when I first got the refractometer, and the bitterness didn't really kick in until at least 50 minutes. I was surprised that bittering was not more gradual.
Chas at Tahoe
Master Brewer
This is my favorite explination. Attached.
I did not understand why when I added hops at 30 min the hop flavor was still so strong. Beersmith told me that the IBU would be half but the flavor was twice as strong.
According to the attached chart the flavor peaks at about 20min, blue line. So instead of reducing the hop flavor by 50% I was increasing it by 35%.
The down side is that my beer flavor is not stable. After 3 months the hop flavor is almost gone. I think, and I need help here, it's because the alpha-acids are only about 50% strength at 30min, red line, so it doesn't release the volumn needed stabilize the flavor as expected.
Short answer: It takes 60 minutes to get all the alpha-acids out of the hops, I think.
I did not understand why when I added hops at 30 min the hop flavor was still so strong. Beersmith told me that the IBU would be half but the flavor was twice as strong.
According to the attached chart the flavor peaks at about 20min, blue line. So instead of reducing the hop flavor by 50% I was increasing it by 35%.
The down side is that my beer flavor is not stable. After 3 months the hop flavor is almost gone. I think, and I need help here, it's because the alpha-acids are only about 50% strength at 30min, red line, so it doesn't release the volumn needed stabilize the flavor as expected.
Short answer: It takes 60 minutes to get all the alpha-acids out of the hops, I think.
Attachments
Chas at Tahoe
Master Brewer
Sorry, I should have given credit.
http://www.brewsupplies.com/hop_characteristics.htm
http://www.brewsupplies.com/hop_characteristics.htm
Chas at Tahoe
Master Brewer
My daughter bought a Hawiian beer for a house warming and I noticed that the bitterness was like a sharp peak then a trailing harshness. My Irish Red, while it was still a little green, had a sharp peak of flavor/bitterness but it did not have the trailing bitterness nor the harshness. After it's in the bottle for a month and a half the bitterness gets more pronounced but not harsh. In the bottle for 3 months or more the bitterness is almost entirely gone.
Based on the chart above, do you think my hop timing is to blame ( 30 min )? I used a noble hop so didn't expect any harsness to begin with.
Maybe I don't know the difference between bitterness and flavor?
Based on the chart above, do you think my hop timing is to blame ( 30 min )? I used a noble hop so didn't expect any harsness to begin with.
Maybe I don't know the difference between bitterness and flavor?