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High gravity finishing yeast?

SharpsRifle

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I did my first parti-gyle brew a few nights ago.
I tweaked  my black butte recipe, did some additions including some peated malt, then doubled it and did it parti-gyle style.
For the first half I only pulled just over 6 gallons of wort, did a 90 minute boil and ended up with 4 gallons of what I hope will be liquid gold.
The problem is the gravity was 1.110.  I used white labs English ale yeast ( WLP002 ) like I usually do for Black Butte, but with the gravity of this wort it's going to come up way short and I'm going to wind up with a way too malty sweet beer when I'm done.  I don't mind if it comes out a bit malty and sweet, but I'm going to want to finish this off way more than the English ale yeast is going to do.

Any thoughts on a high gravity yeast that's going to be good for 12 or 13 percent alcohol and not have a big effect on the flavor profile? 
If I let the yeast play it's self out first, then add the high gravity yeast I should be able to do it without changing the flavor profile too much but I'm not sure what to use?

Any thoughts?
I was going to go to morebeer and order something but I was going to be guessing and figured that maybe I  would ask here.

Another question that I thought of tonight is how to bottle it?
I don't bottle much because draft is so much faster and I like it but this beer is going to need some time.  Whatever I do I will probably be at the yeasts limits making carbonation an issue.
I had thought about just ordering the beer gun that I've been wanting.  I'm not sure what other good option I have for high gravity complex beers that I like to have on hand.  I don't like to tie up a keg with a beer that will be months before it's ready and when it's done, these beers tend to last longer than regular Black Butte or an IPA.  That and with force carbonation you can hit the CO2 levels that you want easier.

Any thoughts?  I'm going to order something very soon and I don't want to drastically change the flavor by choosing the wrong yeast.
 
By the way I mashed at 148 for the first runnings so it should be very a fermentable 1.11 gravity.  I used a huge yeast starter.  I had almost two gallons going, I ended up decanting the liquid and putting the whole thing into a gallon jug with some fresh ( extract ) wort and started about another gallon in a couple jugs with two more vials of yeast and gave the whole second time around about 30 hours before it went into the wort.

Depending on how the first and second runnings turn out, I may opt for a little higher mash temp next time so that it's got more body and less fermentables, but I don't want to weaken the second runnings too much.

Due to the long boil, wort cooling time and me only having the ability to boil one batch at a time the second runnings mashed for an additional 2 plus hours at 148 with about 1 lb 4 oz  of various fresh grains added to it. I would have added a bit more but the tun was full.

I will be getting a new 25 gallon boil kettle and then I'll be using a keggle for a mash tun.  That will give me more flexibility with tweaking the second runnings.  Especially after I add a heat exchange to the mash system.
 
I've made some high gravity beers using Wyeast Scottish Ale Yeast (1728) and Wyeast London Ale Yeast (1028).  They both can handle about 10 to 11.5%.

I used the London Ale yeast (harvested from a RIS) in a Tootsie Roll Stout.  The Tootsie Roll stout was basically my 11% RIS with 5 pounds of tootsie rolls stirred in near the end of the boil.  I pitched in 3/4 of a gallon of harvested yeast slurry into the Tootsie Roll Stout.  It went to 17.5% ABV in a week.  I didn't expect it to get much past 11.5% or 12%.  I was quite happy.  I've now put in champagne yeast in the secondary, and let it go for three weeks, so that the champagne yeast gets the rest of the sugars that champagne yeast can handle.  I'll then bottle it and shouldn't have any problems getting carbonation, since the champagne yeast that I used can handle 22% ABV.  At the time that I racked it from the primary and into the secondary while pitching the champagne yeast, it tasted like tootsie roll flavored bourbon.  I'm very excited to see how it will taste after being in the bottle for a while.

So, I would suggest either the 1728 or the 1028 from Wyeast.  They also do a good job of cleaning up any phenols, etc.
 
Thanks for the reply.
That tootsi roll stout sounds very interesting.

I ended up going with Safale US-05.  It should, in theory bring me to maybe 12%.  That should be enough to not leave it too malty sweat and I don't know that I want it much higher than that.  I might have upped the hop's a it if I had thought about how sweet this could end up being.

I had thought about the Champaign yeast, but I didn't want to dry it out that much. 
Tough call on what to use for me since this is much higher gravity than I make normally.    I want the flavors from the WLP002, so the finishing yeast needed to be something that wasn't going to finish it up by adding a bunch of extra flavors, and like I said I don't want it to dry out too much.  I want to retain a bit of the malt sweetness.

This will be interesting to see how this turns out.  This is only round one.  I'm going to keep working this and refining it. I'm sure I'll be changing up the yeast some in an experiment or two.
One thing I know for sure that I'm doing next time is to add some cocoa nibs to the wort from the first runnings.

I'm going to get a bigger boil pot ( 25 gal ) and change my keggle into my mash tun.  That extra space is going to make parti-gyle brewing a lot different.  I'll be able to do more styles and bigger batches because of a 50% larger mash tun.  I'll also be able to add more grains after the first runnings to help ma the second runnings into something more specific rather than simply a lesser version of the original recipe.

After I get a scotch ale recipe that I think is just right, I'm going to try a parti-gyle with that also!
Lots of new yeast in my future.
 
You may need to hit the primary with oxygen after a few days while fermentation is real active.
 
RiverBrewer said:
You may need to hit the primary with oxygen after a few days while fermentation is real active.

I had thought about that.
I used a ton of oxygen and nutrients when I pitched the first huge yeast starter.
I was a little afraid of oxidation if the yeast didn't end up using the additional oxygen though.

 
Here are a couple of articles on oxygenation.  You'll notice in the articles that over-oxygenation is not an issue, because the yeast will use up all of the dissolved oxygen in the first 3 to 9 hours.

I've never hit my wort with oxygen after my initial yeast innoculation.  The articles and everything I've read all stress that you can end up with off flavors if you hit it later, when the yeast don't need it to build up their cell walls.  This is enough to keep me from hitting it later.

http://www.wyeastlab.com/hb_oxygenation.cfm

http://morebeer.com/category/wort-oxygenation-aeration.html

 
The Wyeast link does have a comment about high gravity wort. I believe I heard this discussed by barleywine brewers. The link mentions theability of HGW to absorb o2
 
I'm a little skeptical of late O2 additions.  The potential downside outweighs the potential gain in my mind.  I may look through "Yeast" a little tonight but for the most part it and everything else I've read says lots of early oxygen is good, late oxygen is bad.
I have to admit though, I've read a bit of the book yeast, but never found time to go through it end to end.
I do wish I would have made a starter with the dry yeast I added late.  You're not supposed to need to but I should have treated it like all my liquid yeast I normally use.

I think I'll check the gravity tonight and if it's not getting when I think it needs to be I might make a starter with the California ale yeast I chose to try and finish the beer off with.
 
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