My Red Beers are brown

I'm trying to create a nice California Red Ale but they keep coming out brown.
Grain Bill: 10 1/2 lbs. Pale Malt
                1/2 lbs. Roasted Barley
                1/4 lbs. Crystal 15
                1/4 lbs. Rye Malt

Any thoughts/insight?  I want to make it as red as possible.

I'm pretty new to this myself, but I have added some carared to up the red color. 
I go by a color chart to adjust to 9-11 Lovibond to get more red.
See the following color chart.

http://beerrecipes.org/beercolor.php

Rjezowski75 said:

I'm trying to create a nice California Red Ale but they keep coming out brown.
Grain Bill: 10 1/2 lbs. Pale Malt
                1/2 lbs. Roasted Barley
                1/4 lbs. Crystal 15
                1/4 lbs. Rye Malt

Any thoughts/insight?  I want to make it as red as possible.

Click to expand...

Try 2 oz roasted barley instead. A little gives a red color without the taste of roasted barley.

try playing around with this Weyermann® Melanoidin Malted Grain for good red color.
also water chemistry and  O.G can affect color.
  my self I would cut the roasted barley like what was said and add .3 # of the melanoidin.   

I experimented around with Carared last year, got good results with it

Digging into my memory cells, which are starting to show their age. Of course, I can't find my notes on this that I made 25 +/- years ago. But let's see if I can confuse things.
Crystal 15 will add a light golden color.
Roasted barley starts out red, but darkens fast into brown.
My basic recipe for a session ale, which is red is as follows:
6 lbs 2-row pale
1 lb munich - 20L
8 oz caramel/crystal - 140L
Note: Everyone at the LHBS's tell me that I should use c/c 60. I don't. I have used darker with good results.
When serious about a decent beer, I will delete caramel/crystal and use melanoidin. I usually increase the munich amounts, and have gone as high as 50%.
I stay away from roasted malts except for porters/stouts.
I would reduce the roasted barley, and use darker c/c (above 90) or melanoidin.
But remember, this is based on old brain cells still screaming for coffee this early in the morning.
Froehliche Weinachten
Ed

I am a bit confused BJCP style wise there is not a Cal Red Ale so are you talking a style or color? For example a Flanders Red is actually brown and is considered a sour beer. If you want a bright red beer brew what you want and add food coloring. But consider that there are many shades of amber but beer has what is called SRM, what SRM do you want?

I was replying to 'Red Ale'. I have brewed for close to 30 years without caring about some BJCP guidelines, I am not going to try and understand them now.
If someone wants to brew a beer called Cal Red, I say 'Go For It!!' I have brewed fire engine red beers without food coloring or crystal malt, or without caring what style it was or what the SRM value was.
Brew for enjoyment. If you want a red ale, learn what the different malts will do. You will find that SRM values are only a compromise at best.
RDWHA'RED'HB

Ed

Rusty Nails said:

I was replying to 'Red Ale'. I have brewed for close to 30 years without caring about some BJCP guidelines, I am not going to try and understand them now.
If someone wants to brew a beer called Cal Red, I say 'Go For It!!' I have brewed fire engine red beers without food coloring or crystal malt, or without caring what style it was or what the SRM value was.
Brew for enjoyment. If you want a red ale, learn what the different malts will do. You will find that SRM values are only a compromise at best.
RDWHA'RED'HB

Ed

Click to expand...

Just jumping into the fray.

I agree with Ed on this. Style guidelines are mainly for competitions. If you brew a beer and it's good and you and others like it, who cares whether it meets any style guidelines or not. Style guidelines are an evolving work. Even the numbers of the categories vary over time. Ten years ago if you would have mentioned an IIPA or a session IPA or a black Belgian beer, people would have looked at you funny! Now, these are accepted styles of beer. Part of the joy of homebrewing is being creative and, at times, throwing the book and guidelines out the window.

On another note------

I have not used melanoidin malt before. Might have to try some of this just to see what it is like. Any suggestions?

I am not sure I understand your comment: "Roasted barley starts out red, but darkens fast into brown." Do you mean that in small amounts (say, 2-3 oz) it is red and with increasing amounts (say, 6-10 oz) it becomes black/dark? I assume this is what you mean.

I used melanoidin in a weizenbock. 3 oz was pretty good but thinking of going to 4-5 oz.

Mark

just have to throw this out there. Maillard Reactions 101: Theory, and how ph of mash can affects srm (color) during the boil.
  one guy can use a grain bill and get a  nice light color to his beer but if he changes his water chemistry a lot, he will get a different color beer with the same grain bill. 

all grain; Agree. Many things can change the outcome. I use GW pale Malt as my base, and just different LHBS will give me different results.
merfizle: Red Weizenbock? Sounds good!
riceral: Yes, I have found that a little roasted barley will give a red color, but will quickly become brown as the amount increases. I only use roasted barley in dark beers, so I don't have the amounts.

My basic starting recipe is a base made from GW Pale, and Munich. I like the combo. The ratio varies. I avoid any hops starting with the letter 'C' (I know, that's considered a felony here in the NW) because I feel too many other brewers are using them. My go -- to hops are Northern Brewer and either US Tetts or Willies. My main yeast is American Pale (SN). I do use Irish Ale (Guiness) on dark beers. And yes, I have swapped them, with good results.
I have taken recipes to the LHBS, and come out with something different. Now I just start with my basic base, and browse the selection for something to add to it. I keep notes, and if it's enjoyable I THEN create the recipe in BS2.

But that's just me.

Prosit
Ed