Lost work

After making a number of changes to a recipe I was considering, I highlighted a number I was thinking about changing.  I decided not to make the change and, by instinct, I hit the [Escape] key . . . which tossed all the changes I had made without any warning it was going to do so.

I like the Beersmith program (great job!), have paid for registration, and plan to continue using it.  But it does violate a simple -- though very important -- rule: never throw away work without warning.

It can be debated whether hitting the [Escape] key (based on other programs I routinely use) should have been an instinct on my part, but tossing a user's work should never be done without warning.  A message with the choices of [save changes], [discard changes], and [cancel (cancel leaving edit)] would be great.

Is there any plan to fix this in the future?  I'd like to be able to recommend Beersmith to others, but can't as long as it tosses away work without any warning it's about to do so.

Thanks,

 Ricky

Re: Confirm Changes Before Closing a Recipe

Thanks for the reply, but it still tosses the changes without any warning even with the "Confirm Changes Before Closing a Recipe" box checked.

 Ricky

Ricky,
 The problem is that pressing "escape" button is equivalent to pressing the "cancel" button on the recipe page.  It does throw the changes away - but try this in any dialog box in almost any Windows application and you will see that they do the same thing.  Escape = Cancel in most Windows apps.

 When designing the program, I tried to adhere to Windows standards wherever possible - thus Escape = Cancel.

 The reason "Confirm changes before saving" does not change this is that  Confirm changes does not apply if you press the CANCEL or OK button since by pressing one of those buttons you have already given consent to save or toss the changes.  Again, escape is the same as Cancel in most Windows apps.

 I will take another look at this - but I'm a little reluctant to redefine a Windows key since so many people use the standard Windows keyboard shortcuts as a matter of habit.

Cheers!
Brad

I guess I wasn't real clear with my note.  

I realize that the [escape] key is normally attached to the [cancel] button.  I've no problem with that and it makes perfectly good sense that you have them linked.

The problem, whether pressing [escape]or clicking [cancel], is when a program tosses away work the user has done without any warning it is about to do so.   I don't think a program should ever throw away work the user has done without a warning.

So, as I mentioned in my original post, a message (and I'll add that I mean whether [escape] is pressed or the [cancel] button clicked) that asks if the user is sure he/she wants to "exit the recipe and discard the changes" would be nice.

Thanks again, Brad.

 Ricky

I'll take another look at this, but I'm not sure exactly what to do.  It would probably seem odd to a user if he presses "Cancel" or escape and then gets asked "Do you really want to throw away your data?".

Perhaps I could create another option that lets you confirm ALL changes.

Cheers!
Brad

>It would probably seem odd to a user
>if he presses "Cancel" or escape and
>then gets asked "Do you really want
>to throw away your data?".

It wouldn't seem odd to me, after making a number of changes, to have the program ask if I want to throw away all of those changes I just spent time making.  It would seem normal.  Every other program I use asks before tossing my changes.  But on the other hand, I think of the recipe edit screen as a document and, as a document, it isn't standard programming to toss the work with the escape key.  Maybe you look at it as a dialog box where it would be more standard.

For example, in Excel, if I am making a change to a cell, the escape key is used to stop making the change and revert to the original cell value.  But the document (worksheet) doesn't have a "cancel" function, it's just at the cell level.  

If on BeerSmith I'm making a change to the batch size (for example) and hit escape, I'd expect it to return the batch size to the original, not toss everything I've spent the last thirty minutes changing without any warning.  It'd be like Excel tossing a couple hours work on a spreadsheet without warning when I press the escape key.

Bottom line, maybe we look at it differently.  User data, in my mind, is sacrosanct and you don't throw it away under any circumstances without warning the user.  Ever.  But my programming was to a different customer base than yours.

In any case, thanks for the reply.

 Ricky

I have tested the actions of the <excape> key of the various applications that I run under the Windows environment.  In no case does the <escape> key undo all changes for a session.  Specifically, in Microsoft Access, the <escape> key will undo any changes in the field you are currently editing.  All other changes remain intact, and you are not removed from the record being edited.  Microsoft Excel, similarly, "undos" the changes in the active cell; all other changes remain intact and you remain on the active spreadsheet.

I cannot find any application, other than BeerSmith, that undos all edit changes for a session and removes the user from the active record.

It appears that the most consistent action for the <escape> key should be to undo any changes in the active field, leave all other changes alone and remain in the edit mode for the current record.

Richard,
 I was thinking of a dialog box (which the main view acts as).

 Try opening a complex dialog box in any of your major programs, make a ton of changes to it and press escape.  It won't save anything!

 Nevertheless - I've already added a new setting to my "to do" list - basically it will require you to confirm all changes if the option is set.

 Also - note the following interesting thread -- Someone complaining that their work was saved:

   http://www.beersmith.com/cgi-bin/yabb/YaBB.cgi?board=Support;action=display;num=1062254366

 In any case - I do appreciate the input and I will work towards adding a new option to "confirm everything" before saving.  That way you can decide if you want it saved or not.

Cheers!
Brad

Brad:

Thanks for being responsive and looking at ways to accommodate.  As you can probably guess, I'm with Richard on how the [Escape] key should function as I don't consider anything I spend an hour editing to be a dialog box.  But your solution should solve my complaint.  

Best,
 Ricky

Ricky,
 I just modified the new version so it will no longer "Cancel" changes from the main recipe entry view.

 I think this is a good solution - since as you pointed out there is no real reason to accept the "escape" shortcut in a major entry view like this.

 Note that escape still does the things that make sense - like close a drop down if you have one open.

 What do you think?

Brad

Sounds perfect.  Thanks.

 Ricky